Special Needs Sharing Question: Are your child's special social needs understood? About This Page:

[Sandra Bostwick]

Originally Posted by Christine43

What I want from society in general is an understanding of who Autistic people are and for them to be treated with respect and compassion but not to underestimate what they are capable of. That would require parents of neuro typical children to teach their children about kids with special needs. It would make life a little bit easier for families like mine. I really thank you for taking an interest in this, Dana, I appreciate it.

I agree with that one!

As an OT, I have alot of contact with parents of all types of kids with special needs. One of the biggest problems out there is a lack of understanding, tolerance and kindness toward anyone who is "different". It sure would be nice if parents took the time to teach their typical (whatever that means!) children about special needs.

I work in a private school, and so many of my parents report that bullying or isolation rank right up there with the need for specialized teachers and services when pulling their students from district. I think I hear so many comments about how happy they are that their child is with similar students once they get to a specialized school.

I hear the same thing over and over..the kid with special needs in mainstream sits alone at lunch and plays alone at free time IF they are lucky. More likely, they are targets. When my kids tell me what they endured, I don't wonder why some of them develop behaviors and anger!

What blows MY mind these days is that roving packs of mean-spirited children are just looking for a target, ANY target, these days. The student who acts or looks different is just more likely to stand out and be chosen.

I also think the parents are happy that, when they have a parent activity or group, they are accepted and understood by the other parents. Believe it or not, PARENTS of typical kids can also be isolative with the parents of special needs students!



(I was afraid that this might be spinning an earlier thread a bit off topic, and I'd really like to hear what people have to say on this subject, so I opened up a new thread.)


OK, here is the new discussion thread!

[Christine43]

AMEN!!!!!!! Sandra, do you mind if I print this out and show it to a couple of people?
One of the reasons Perry's school and I don't see eye to eye is that they have this ridiculous notion that mainstreaming the spec. ed. kids with all the other kids for "specials" would bring them all together in this beautific, harmonious place where everyone loves and tolerates everyone. Are you kidding me??? Now, I know most kids are not vicious, but kind, but I'm not giving any of the vicious, cruel, mocking, rotten kids (who usually have parents with similar personalities) any chance of getting anywhere near my son who is still a child. If they were seriously dedicated to this idea they would have behavioral groups to teach the neuro typical kids about all kinds of disabilities and behavioral classes for the spec. ed kids to understand when someone is being mean and how to handle these kids in the best and worst scenarios. Do they do that? Oh, no, that would take time and finances so I told them to stick it when they continually bothered me about this. Then they did it behind my back anyway and since it was in the IEP, I threatened them legally and it stopped. But, they are still trying to get me to observe a gym class for Perry to partake in. Absolutely not!!! I mean gym can be a rough class for anyone but I'm not going to have my Autistic son trying to interact with kids in that arrangement.
They just don't get it or they do get it but to benefit themselves they do not care. I honestly believe that after dealing with my three boys and their schools for the past 15 years.
Some of these kids who are unkind don't know any better because their parents behave the exact same way and the schools don't take it upon themselves to teach them either. We've had parents make comments as well as the kids when we've been out. Perry, Tristan and Gaelen went apple picking with a family friend and his family several years ago, Perry must have been around seven or eight. Cousin of the friend, an adult, told another child with them to throw apples at Perry "because he won't even notice" and it will be funny. When I heard this I felt homicidal. Ironically, this moron has a child with Autism now.
I don't really socialize with a lot of Moms in the area who have NT kids because for one reason or another, they just can't understand my life and I have no time, basically.
If schools don't want to pay the tuition for children with special needs then they should be doing more in their own environment to help these children succeed appropriately, stop passing the buck, take responsibility and help support families like mine with society and education.
Incidentally, I just got a lawyer and I am soooooo looking forward to our hearing with the school system in court. They are supposed to be giving Perry A, B, C & D, are providing him with just a little, sad bit of A & B and they just can't prove otherwise so Perry hopefully will be in a private school come September 7. I am not giving up, I will never give up.

[guitardiva]

I think that the purpose of mainstreaming is not to create the "harmonious " thing but to ideally get the special needs students a bit more accustomed to the "real world" (so to speak) The process is intended to prepare the student to be a functioning part of society. The goal is excellent...having said that the ideal world and real world often do not mix. After what seemed like a never ending battle , my daughter was placed in a brand new Autism class. There are 7 kids between the ages of 6 and 10, and 3 teachers. They teach the children social skills as well as academics. A big goal is to get the children mainstreamed. They do this by combining the class with the 2nd grade class for gym, Spanish and music. The rest is individualized according the the student's needs. My DD8 goes the the 2nd grade class for math and reading also. There is an aide who stands back until needed. They try to avoid having her become dependant on him. They have adjusted her time out of her special class as needed. This bit by bit technique is working out well. I have heard of ASD children being put in a mainstream class full time only and with some it works and others it don't. One mom told me that her son was fully mainstreamed last year and that it was bad. He felt that he was "stupid" because he was'nt like the other kids. They had a bad time of it. really sad.
The other side of the coin is that this interaction with the "regular" kids, will teach. How can the population learn if the group they need to learn about is isolated? I do think that the mainstream population should be taught more about other children who have special needs.
This is a fascinating topic to me, not only because of my daughter , but because I'm currently in school for OT. I hope to one day work with these beautiful children, I want to learn what will best help them.

[Sandra Bostwick]

Originally Posted by guitardiva

I think that the purpose of mainstreaming is not to create the "harmonious " thing but to ideally get the special needs students a bit more accustomed to the "real world" (so to speak) The process is intended to prepare the student to be a functioning part of society. The goal is excellent...having said that the ideal world and real world often do not mix.

One mom told me that her son was fully mainstreamed last year and that it was bad. He felt that he was "stupid" because he was'nt like the other kids. They had a bad time of it. really sad.

The other side of the coin is that this interaction with the "regular" kids, will teach. How can the population learn if the group they need to learn about is isolated? I do think that the mainstream population should be taught more about other children who have special needs.
This is a fascinating topic to me, not only because of my daughter , but because I'm currently in school for OT. I hope to one day work with these beautiful children, I want to learn what will best help them.

Spoken like a true OT, because there ARE two sides to this coin!

I've also found that, for EVERY horror mainstreaming story, I hear a very positive story. I looked back at my Original Post, and I hope it does not sound as if I am either for or against mainstreaming, because it is a completely individual situation. I was just commenting that, but the time students make it to a specialized school, I'm hearing that it is the SOCIAL issues and NOT the academic issues that forced the issue.

I think a discussion on the pros and cons of mainstreaming would be impossible because for some, it is the best choice, and for others, it isn't. That is a WHOLE other thread!

The ultimate end-goal is to prepare students for the real world which, as we all know, is mainstreamed!

[nurse_mom]

I think to be fair. Every child has different needs. Not every child is able to be mainstreamed. Maybe not ideal, but its what is best for the child. Let's face it "social" life can be cruel. It breaks my heart that kids are mean to my DD. But so can people in the "real" world. I understand ultimate end goals, however, not every child gets there, and it doesn't help the terrible sinking feeling in you heart that your child is upset.

[Sandra Bostwick]

Originally Posted by nurse_mom

it doesn't help the terrible sinking feeling in you heart that your child is upset.

I HATE that terrible sinking feeling, and I know exactly what you are talking about!

[simbarel]

I'm very pre-InTheKnow about this topic, DS is on a waiting list for an integrated classroom through CDS, and I had concerns about how it actually works. I'm forced to take babysteps, but where I am I still don't think that people in "real life" are anywhere's as cruel as those in a school situation can be. I was led to believe that at DS's age the children don't even know who's who (my DS's major issue is speech/language) and they all get along hunky dory. Now that I've read this I'm back to wondering if that's true (he's still very young, so hopefully it is.) Thanks for bringing it up!

[CinderAbby]

Believe it or not, PARENTS of typical kids can also be isolative with the parents of special needs students!

I am definitely a victim of this. I've been to many school events with Abby and while all the kids are absolutely great with her, most parents, once they hear who my child is, will usually make small talk then stop talking all together or turn and start talking to someone else. Needless to say, I usually spend the events standing or sitting off by myself.

As far as Abby is concerned, I guess I'm lucky. She's high functioning enough that she can be mainstreamed and like I said, all the kids are great with her. The teachers tell me the kids are always trying to help her ( and often successfully) and if Abby gets upset, there's always 2 or 3 kids in the class that try to calm her down before it gets too bad. At this age (grade 4) the kids are all very accepting of her. At recess she plays equally with the boys and girls. And at our IEP meetings, everything is looked at from all angles and the teachers listen to what I have to say. The one and only time I had an issue with a teacher doing something she shouldn't have actually happened when Abby was in kindergarten. The teacher wanted to stop giving Abby PT saying she was at grade level. I knew she wasn't and that was our bone of contention. The teacher didn't like Abby (and Abby knew this and did not like the teacher either) and couldn't handle Abby's outbursts (which were really, really bad only with this teacher) so she didn't want to deal with Abby anymore. I went to our inclusion coordinator about this, told her what was going on (teacher was dropping Abby because of behaviors, not because she was at grade level) and told her either get Abby another teacher or the PT teacher was just going to have to suck it up, learn how to teach Abby and just do it. I would not accept no PT for Abby - she still needed it at the time. Of course the coordinator gave PT the benefit of the doubt (that Abby was at grade level), but she said she would look into it and 2 days later I got a brand new IEP that had Abby back in PT. Unfortunately it wasn't with a new teacher but the teacher and the coordinator came up with some sort of reward system (I think it was play time on the computer) for Abby completeing her tasks so that last year with that PT teacher was better. There was still dislike on both sides, but the behaviors weren't as bad.

[Pax]

Originally Posted by Sandra Bostwick

I hear the same thing over and over..the kid with special needs in mainstream sits alone at lunch and plays alone at free time IF they are lucky. More likely, they are targets. When my kids tell me what they endured, I don't wonder why some of them develop behaviors and anger!

And it's not just learning disabled kids, or phsyically disabled kids, who face this.

Just being a quiet, bookish sort got me much the same treatment in school as a boy ... all the way, straight through the end of highschool.

I am convinced that Public schools are no longer about education, they are instead about indoctrination. Their purpose is not to teach ... but to turn children into obedient drones, working for the betterment of the hive. Conformity, uniformity, and collective group-think are praised, encouraged, and rewarded. Individuality ... not so much, except among the few and rare superachievers. And even there, that individuality os mroe quirks than being truly, fundamentally different.

If I had a son or daughter, let me tell you, I'd live on ramen noodles for the next twenty years, heck I'd literally sell my SOUL if that's what it took ... I would NEVER expose them to the evil, corrosive poison that is the Public School System.

Certain specific kinds of school - magnet schools, charter schools, etc - may be better. But generally speaking ... the Public School System is the last and worst place to put a child who is in any way "different".



EDIT: hmm, wow do I sound bitter, above. But sadly, not without cause.

[ilovejack72]

ok i have a child with autism mild very high functioning . what really gets me mad is when i travel with him he is 14 and when we fly he has to sit in the front of the plan cant sit near the wing wont sit anywhere near the emergency exit you get my point so we fly sw and always get him preseated so he can sit just where he wants. the airline it self is great about this but other passengers on the other hand always seem it want to be in ther two cents in the perboard line. ive gotten everything from why are you in this line theres nothing wrong with you , to you are in the wrong line. i even had a lady flip out on me because she said i lied about my son so i could get in this line. i try to just not respond. some adults really need an education in treating others who are different with diginity and respect including childern. so if adults are acting this way no wonder where having trouble with kids bullying other kids. it starts with uneducated parents.

[jams67]

DS1's school has a program called Best Buddies. It is a wonderful program that is a group of neuro typical kids get together during school hours. Sometimes they do an organized activity as instructed by the teacher, sometimes it's an activity organized by the kids and sometimes it's just hanging out, all the kids just being together. They also take field trips together. The program is so popular, there is a waiting list and the neuro typical kids are screened very carefully before being accepted.

Jack is intergrated into NT specials during the school year. He's done cooking, drama and art. An associate teacher goes with him in case he needs help. Most of the time, other students in the classes help him when he needs it. I have also heard (from this associate) that it has been a good learning experience for the NT kids. They have asked her questions about Jack's behavior. I see every opportunity as a learning experience and have told his teachers to answer questions truthfully. Don't sugar coat, this is the way he is. Take him or leave him. I believe this helped others understand better and they have learned quite alot from him. His art teacher even praised Jack for picking up a yogurt container and saying "Look, I found a seashell. I can hear the ocean." The teacher loved this and suggested to the other students they take a page from "The Jack book of seeing things differently" when looking at everyday objects.

That all being said, I am not a fan of mainstreaming for my child. His brain does not learn the same way a NT student does. I cannot expect to put him in a class with kids his age and expect him to thrive academically. It is also why I don't homeschool him. I don't understand the way his brain thinks (i just know it's different) therefore I do not see myself or a regular ed teacher being able to have the skills to teach him. I wouldn't take my car to the electrician to get fixed. Jack's teachers specialize in teaching kids who think outside the box. I need to leave it to the best qualified (IMO) professionals.

He attends a summer day program that is 5 weeks long, 8 hrs a day, where they help the kids maintain their school learning but also do camp things. It's a bit of a strain as it is in upstate NY. We live with my mom for 6 weeks every summer and see DH only a about 6-10 days in that time. But it is the best thing for Jack and that's what I need to remember.

As far as traveling with him, we fly at least a couple of times a year. When we fly I have a shirt from a support group with the logo on it written very large on the front and back. I wear it every time we fly. I ask to preboard also. Sure I get looks but frankly I could care less. I let him stim and give the ignorant something to think about.

I can't change the way some people think just as I can't make Jack not autistic. I'm not even sure I can make them tolerate ANYONE who is different from themselves. When I do experience someone like that, it just confirms to me that I have the best life of anyone I know. I am truly blessed and truly happy with who I am, who my kids are and the people they are becoming. I even love my hubby after 20 years. NO ONE can take that from me.

Julie

PS Sorry it's so long.

[busybee1]

Originally Posted by jams67

He attends a summer day program that is 5 weeks long, 8 hrs a day, where they help the kids maintain their school learning but also do camp things. It's a bit of a strain as it is in upstate NY.

Julie - May I ask where this camp is located? We have been looking into camps and it sounds like you have had a positive experience. Thanks!!

[jams67]

Originally Posted by busybee1

Julie - May I ask where this camp is located? We have been looking into camps and it sounds like you have had a positive experience. Thanks!!

It's in Watertown, NY. If you want any more info, send me a PM. I'll be happy to share.