Eisner and the "Shiite Muslims" reference
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AKLRULZ · 12-02-2003, 07:51 AM

From Drudge:

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In hour-long interview with LA TIMES on Monday departing DISNEY board members Disney and Gold -- Gold claims 'Eisner called him and others -- including Pixar Chairman Steve Jobs -- 'Shiite Muslims.' Gold took that to mean that Eisner believed his critics were extreme in their views. A company spokeswoman said Eisner 'categorically denies' calling anyone a 'Shiite Muslim.' LA TIMES editors will not publish the 'Shiite' claim from Gold, newspaper sources tell DRUDGE. 'We didn't have solid enough grounds to put the statement in the newspaper,' Business Editor, Rick Wartzman, explained late Monday...

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Just gets more insane by the minute!

Dumbo · 12-02-2003, 08:24 AM

Michael Eisner saved the company in the 80's and now it looks like he wants to distroy it. I think it's time for Eisner to go. I don't think it will happen anytime soon, howerver. Heard on the news last night the Disney board is more or less yes Michael.

mattjs · 12-02-2003, 10:39 AM

Yup, the gloves are off. My gut says Eisner probly made the remark, and now regrets phrasing it that way. Feels too specific to be made up. Also, he obviously didn't say it directly to Disney and Gold...so somebody on the inside is leaking to them.

Nice move on Golds part I guess. Lets Eisner know "it's on", and anything goes. This is just the beggining, but I'm gonna guess Eisner's ultimately gonna lose (moneywise he's already a BIG WINNAH so no tears here).

I'm now 100% sure Gold and Disney have a master plan. And it sounds like they want this thing to stay right up on the front burner.........so, I bet this is gonna get real interesting. And probly sonner rather than later.

The big questions I have are, who do Roy and Gold have (or are linin' up) on thier side? Who's on thier short list to succeed Eisner? And/or do they already have somebody in the wings? Roy dropped John Lasseters name in an interview yesterday. Not in the direct context of being Eisners successor. But it was right after he talked about Disney needing fresh creative management. And who's more creative than Lasseter right now? High times for the rumors board for sure

mattjs · 12-02-2003, 11:06 AM

This stuff is just too fun

Supposing there's something to the Lasseter bit, could we see a Disney/Pixar merger of sorts? Anybody with a stronger financial background...does that sound like something that's even doable? I mean, I suppose if Lasseter/Pixar execs. got big hunks of Disney stock? And Lasseter takes over as head of Disney! This really is too fun

Shell_of_the_South · 12-04-2003, 03:19 PM

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This stuff is just too fun

Supposing there's something to the Lasseter bit, could we see a Disney/Pixar merger of sorts? Anybody with a stronger financial background...does that sound like something that's even doable? I mean, I suppose if Lasseter/Pixar execs. got big hunks of Disney stock? And Lasseter takes over as head of Disney! This really is too fun

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Disney/Pixar merger - what a great sounding idea! I'm really afraid Disney is going to botch their relationship with Pixar and lose a major money maker, not to mention the source of some great family entertainment.

Cameron's mom · 12-05-2003, 01:50 PM

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Disney/Pixar merger - what a great sounding idea! I'm really afraid Disney is going to botch their relationship with Pixar and lose a major money maker, not to mention the source of some great family entertainment.

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I agree. Let's hope Eisner does what it takes to keep Pixar happy.

DisneyDoll · 12-02-2003, 04:28 PM

Not surprised that Eisner said that. He has always had a big mouth. Remember the nasty comments he make about Jeffrey Katzenberg in the 90's? Let's just say that this a family site and I can't repeat the offensive material.
Eisner's contract with the company is up in 2006. I don't think he can be ousted before then. But he should "start planning a graceful exit"-miceage.com

Jsbalcio1 · 12-03-2003, 02:39 PM

If you read Gold's resignation he let itbe known that the only way he flt he could comment on anything and evrything wrong with Disney was to resign and attack. Not too bad of a plan! It is too bad that the Disney stock price has not dropped a little more than it has. Maybe that would scare Michael into doing the right thing, which is to Resign or actually do something besides build sub-par parks and rides.

Shan-man · 12-03-2003, 10:27 PM

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Maybe that would scare Michael into doing the right thing, which is to Resign or actually do something besides build sub-par parks and rides.

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Ouch, now wait a minute. I might jump on the bandwagon and wail and moan about the slashing of quality and cannibalizing that Eisner has done. But "sub-par parks"! There is nothing sub-par about D/MGM or AK! There is nothing sub-par about M:S, or Typhoon Lagoon, or Blizzard Beach! There is nothing sub-par about the Grand Floridian, AKL or Wilderness Lodge. I can't think of anything Disney that is not waaaay above par. Disney at its worst is far better than Busch Gardens or Six Flags at their best. I'm sure you meant below the Disney par, but even then I would be hard pressed to agree that the AK is lower quality than the MK, for instance. The studios and the imagineers are doing superlative work in my opinion, the only part I have major concerns with is HR at the parks themselves... the personallities at the parks seem duller than in years past. Everyone seemed to sparkle and were really enthused about working at Disney. Today, they seem like they are as enthused as your average Taco Bell cashier. If there is a major problem at Disney, it's that its employees feel like they are working for a soulless money-grubbing machine... and that sense can only grow with Roy's departure

Jsbalcio1 · 12-10-2003, 11:06 AM

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I might jump on the bandwagon and wail and moan about the slashing of quality and cannibalizing that Eisner has done. But "sub-par parks"! There is nothing sub-par about D/MGM or AK! There is nothing sub-par about M:S, or Typhoon Lagoon, or Blizzard Beach! There is nothing sub-par about the Grand Floridian, AKL or Wilderness Lodge. I can't think of anything Disney that is not waaaay above par.

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I did not say anything about WDW. By Disney standards California Adventure is sub-par and until recently so was Disneyland Paris.

I would agree with you though that th HR in the parks is sub-par. To many people do not realize that they are working in the happiest place on earth and it show!

Irene · 12-10-2003, 07:18 AM

I can't believe its any good for the board of directors to have such turmoil.

Mickey was a good guy! Walt never expected it to be such an icon. I don't want to see it destroyed.

Irene · 12-10-2003, 07:18 AM

Makes me about wanting to own any stock now!

mattjs · 12-16-2003, 01:03 PM

I generally agree with you there Dave. In comparison to other US Disney parks, DCA was probably no more or less "complete" than anything else when it opened. Heck, when you think about it, there was practically nothing at MGM when it opened up.

The thing I wonder though, is has Tokyo Disney Sea somewhat raised (or returned to previous levels) the bar on new parks? And not so much in a count the attractions kinda way, but more in a "level of theming and creativity of concept" kinda way. Of course, I haven't actually been to DCA or TDS yet

, so I'm really just thinking out loud here. But, I have looked at tons of pictures of each on the web (and read a few reviews). And to me, I see a pretty stark contrast in the level of theming, detail, and creativity of concept between the two parks. From the pictures I've seen (a questionable basis for sure) DCA just feels like a step below other recent projects.

By example, I'd argue that DCA doesn't appear to stack up all that favorably against even the most recent US park -- AK. Which I think was a much more creative idea, and was themed to incredible detail. Again though, the fact that I've never been to TDS or DCA, and the fact that I'm really talking about matters of preference here (my obsession with/interpretation of theming and creativity)...maybe it's a moot point.

Would love to get your thoughts though on the impact (if any) TDS has in terms of perception. Did Oriental Land Co. out Disney Disney in this case? Is it even fair to compare the two to begin with? Other factors I'm not considering?

In terms of one of it's problems being in California, I totally agree. My take on that is, it's just not that desirable a concept in that location. Plastic California...in California??? I'd go, but then I'm a Disney fanatic. And even I have to wonder...I LOVE Animal Kingdom. But, if I found myself actually in Africa, would I go on a real live Safari? Or Disney's Animal Kingdom, Kenya? Maybe the marketing numbers for DCA showed something different though. Still, I feel like at least in Florida, DCA would have had the advantage of being a little bit exotic.

**Dave Marx** · 12-16-2003, 04:00 PM

I haven't been to Tokyo or Paris, so it's hard to comment on those parks, or to compare them to DCA. I take each park I visit on its own merits. It shouldn't be a matter of what a park isn't - it has to be what it is.

DCA stands up just fine in my book, and it keeps getting better.

Is AK a more "creative idea?" I'm not willing to go that far. It may actually be tougher to create an "impression of California" in the U.S., where we already have our own first-hand experiences and/or deep-set cultural impressions, than it is to create an Africa and Asia that nearly none of us have visited in person, or a Main Street that never was.

For me, the epitome of Disney's "evocotive" lands are World Showcase at Epcot, New Orleans Square at DL, and both Main Streets, of course. Each park has at least one land that can measure-up to those benchmarks. At DCA, I think every land manages to measure-up. Each is successful at capturing the "fantasy essence" of its model. The lands at DCA are beautifully integrated into the concept, and deliver great theming. I never tire of looking at the sunset glow on the rocks of Grizzly Peak, or the dazzling lights of Paradise Pier at night. I don't think any other U.S. Disney park delivers more beautiful vistas than DCA--wherever you stop, you'll find an attractive view. A Bug's Land is a far better addition to DCA than Chester and Hester's was for AK. Magic of Disney Animation at DCA is a much more impressive tribute than the version at Studios (especially since the rehab at Studios), I'd give anything to have productions like Aladdin in Orlando, and we all can't wait to experience Soaring at Epcot. And so it goes.

Do you buy into the "plastic California" concept? I do. There will always be some confusion over whether Anaheim's second park is supposed to cater to Californians or to out-of-town visitors, or both. The reality, though, is that the "pundits" are Californians, and generally believe Disneyland exists to serve only Californians. As a visitor to California, I have a very different impression. I want to experience the real icons, of course. But when I'm visiting Los Angeles, most of the icons celebrated by DCA are far away - San Francisco, Monterey, the Sierras, the Tinseltown fantasy.... I really appreciate Disney's "impression" of the rest of the state - I want to revisit the real places, just as World Showcase makes me want to visit the rest of the world.

Personally, I think DCA was a far more "complete" park on opening day than AK was. Remember all the people who insisted that AK was a half-day park?

But DCA is really something quite different than one of WDW's free-standing major parks. At WDW, a park-hopping guest is 20 minutes away from the "neighboring" park. DCA is a one minute walk across the plaza from DL. As long as you have park hopping privileges, the two parks (plus Downtown Disney) blend into a single experience. You can hop between the two parks all day long, and the total experience is fantastic. So, to me, it doesn't matter whether you spend an hour at DCA, a half-day, or a whole day. It's really just part of the overall DL experience. To me, DL Park is a very claustrophobic experience with dense crowds, and densely-packed attractions. DCA, by comparison, is a breath of fresh air. Not only because the crowds are smaller, but because of the basic design of the park. When DL gets to be too much for me, DCA beckons. And when I run out of things to do at DCA, back to DL I go. Try doing that at WDW without exhausting yourself!

Did TDS "raise the bar?" I think too many of us are guilty of believing (and repeating without attribution) what the pundits have said. And just how many of those pundits have been to Tokyo? The models on display at One Man's Dream are sure pretty, when you have access to the Imagineers who designed TDS you're likely to be enthralled by their descriptions and tales, and those Travel Channel shows always put their destinations in the best possible light.... Jennifer (who lived two years in Japan) keeps promising to bring me there. Until then, the jury's out.

The California pundits seem to relate to "their" parks the way the home team crowd relates to their professional sports teams. They "own" them, even when they aren't stockholders. Only perfection is good enough, and off with the heads of any manager/head coach who doesn't produce a championship season every year. That makes for a whole lot of unhappiness. Personally, I'd rather be delighted than disappointed. As Stephen Stills once wrote, "If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with."

Jsbalcio1 · 12-16-2003, 04:34 PM

Matt, I think you summed up what I was trying to say.

Tokyo raised the bar and then DCA comes in under the bar. A company like DIsney must continually meet or reach the bar that they set. Anything less will draw some criticism. I understand the need to try newthings out, and realize that not everything will work.